Core Radio Interview Transcript with Sasha Ivanov | Sunday October 23, 2016

“Aright good morning and welcome to core radio this is lootz on a Sunday morning and it’s a little early I know normally a little later but I have somebody from across the world that is here today, and I think you all know him. His name is Sasha.”

LOOTZ: “We’ve had a lot of interesting things go on this week. Rob Wilson of Incent came on and he told us all about what’s going to happen after the ICO, in the last episode.”

“Today we have Sasha from waves and he’s going to tell us about this new white paper that came out, and he’s going to enlighten us on the full nodes… I’m pretty sure they’re coming out soon, from what I’ve heard. If you follow the ‘test-net maintainers channel’ in Waves Slack… you can test with the testers. You can put up a full node and have fun finding problems with them. We discussed this in our last episode with Sasha. Waves just came out with a new release, and Sasha is going to elaborate more on that release and what the differences are.”

“Good morning Sasha, how are you?”

SASHA: “Hello.”

LOOTZ: “You were telling me about Lola (Dabota) and the show (Waves Weekly Crypto Round Up).”

SASHA: “Yea. She went back to the U.K. for a while; I don’t know for how long. She’s probably going to come back, but for now, we have another girl (presenter). Her name is Grace; she’s from California. She’s living in Moscow and as far as I understand, the show isn’t on YouTube yet, but it will be by tonight probably. She’s a very nice girl and very professional… The way she speaks, she could probably be a professional news reporter.”

LOOTZ: “Nice… So we’ve got a new reporter for the show, that’s awesome. There’s also a new paper out about scalability. What’s that all about?”

SASHA: “It’s not a whitepaper actually. It’s more of a scientific paper. It will be published during a conference proceeding, or maybe in a scientific journal. So, we did that with a Boston professor Leonid Reyzin and the two guys from Scorex / IOHK, Dmitry and Alexander. I took part in discussions, so my name is also there. The whole idea is about scalability and the development of like, merkle tree ideas. When you have data structures that are small, but they kind of replace the whole blockchain, you don’t have this blockchain bloat. You can have a small amount of data with which you can verify all the transactions. This is the approach and it is necessary for scalability. If we want to have many assets and many custom tokens, this will be absolutely necessary. Otherwise, every miner will have to check all of the transactions. You would have more or less the same situation as in Ethereum where everybody has to execute all the contracts. We want to have some scalability right from the start. With this approach, if we implement it.. up to now it is pretty sophisticated and there is code for this, but we have to make some proper production code out of this approach… If we do that, we will have scalability right from the start. We’ll be able to issue as many assets on the network as we want, and it’s absolutely necessary for scalability. I think it will be a very nice thing if properly implemented. No one has had this before, and I think it is a pretty great idea. It’s pretty essential for the future of blockchain technology; not only for Waves but also in general.”

LOOTZ: “Nice. Did I hear you mention contracts? There’s going to be 3rd party contracts? Like smart contracts?”

SASHA: “No, we don’t have contracts yet… smart contracts I mean. We’ll have multi-signatures… It’s doable, but just not now, it’s not so difficult actually. It will be more or less like phasing in NXT but we will get down to it probably later. About smart contracts; we have a plan, but it’s going to take us a while to start implementing this. It will be Spring maybe, but not earlier. For now, we want to launch the full nodes, and to start issuing the assets so people can come to us and issue their assets. Come to us and start crowdfunding campaigns. This is the most essential thing I think. We are about … custom tokens.”

LOOTZ: “So, I saw that there was an update on the test-net that includes the tokens and assets. People can use them now?… I’ve heard really good things, and that they work flawlessly. No one has found any issues with it?”

SASHA: “Yea, well, there were some actually. I won’t conceal this; we found a couple bugs. Some people helped us, especially I’d like to mention Hawky, our German colleague. He found some pretty bad bugs actually because there were some serious mistakes we had made. We have eliminated these. There are several test-net releases, and each one gets better. So, I think probably, we are going to get a stable release with all bugs fixed. After all, we are going to have the full nodes guys. We have everything we planned for the full nodes. We have assets, we have stable POS (proof of stake), and we have made fee adjustments on Friday… We have more or less a sound network, which probably won’t be that fast for now. But, it will be working and it will be stable. As soon as all test-net release work fine, we’re going to have the full nodes, and we won’t implement new features for now. The goal now is to have the full nodes. It is quite possible that we will have them the week after next, so in about 10 days we can release them.”

LOOTZ: “You mentioned it’s not going to be fast for now. Are there plans to make it any faster after?”

SASHA: “Absolutely. If we implement this authenticated data structure approach, (in regards to) the article we wrote actually, it’s going to be really fast. We’ll have a scalability roadmap that no one has. So, our goal is to have very fast transactions. We are not focusing on having smart contracts, for now, so you won’t be able to do fancy stuff like issuing some dumb (or dull?) contract on our network yet. But, you will be able to issue your tokens and trade them instantly more or less because we will have centralized order matching with decentralized settlement. So, it’s going to be an instant exchange that we’re working on. No one has this either. We’re going to have a very sound and solid system that will be robust and very business oriented. So, we won’t have contracts (upon release of full nodes), but we will have many other interesting things that no one has now.”

LOOTZ: “Contracts are just a plus for me. Already, using Scala makes Waves very special. Getting it to work using that specific language is sort of like when NXT came out. Everyone said ‘…oh it’s made in java; that’s what makes it special.’ Well if you know java, java’s not that great right? I don’t hear good things about java. In my job, a lot of the programmers don’t like java.”

SASHA: “Yea it’s not so bad but you know you could have some other issues here when you start coding in java. Multi-threading, and stuff like this, is all solved in Scala. So it’s in a way easier in Scala, but there are other things that you have to take care of. Every programming language has its drawbacks. You could code anything in java or Scala; language doesn’t matter that much I think…”

LOOTZ: “Java makes it easier, but Scala is a little stricter in how it’s supposed to work.”

SASHA: “Yea it’s a bit more complicated. It’s a bit more difficult to make a bug in Scala, but you can still make some pretty nasty bugs. There are some issues with the network layer. We are fixing them, and we are moving forward. No one did that in Scala I think. No peer-to-peer system has been coded in Scala, so we are the first. We are the first ones, so we have to face some obstacles.“

LOOTZ: “I actually saw a name, ‘Crowd Start’, or ‘Start Crowd’; is that going to be a new function where people can start crowdfunding?”

SASHA: “Yea, that’s a brand for our crowdfunding functionality. Our system is versatile but we are focusing, from a business point of view on crowdfunding and value transfer. They will be the most obvious use cases that we’re are trying to push somehow. So we’ll have a brand for our crowdfunding functionality (called) “Crowd Starter”. It is going to be named so you can go into the client and issue your token easily so that you can start crowdfunding for Waves, for Bitcoins, for fiat money. We’ll have fiat on our blockchain soon too. As soon as we have assets, we will activate the gateways, and you’ll be able to transfer fiat money.”

LOOTZ: “It’s going to be quick huh? That’s awesome. Are you going to have your own Crowd Start website? Like, Kickstarter?”

SASHA: “Yea we are talking to some platforms that want to implement the tokens. There are some Kickstarter-like sites that exist now that want to implement the tokens. So, they can add Waves functionality, and they have a userbase, so it will be much faster. We could also start our own platform but we prefer to work with third parties on that. If someone wants to implement this Kickstarter thing, centralized, it’s possible. So, we can help them, but they have to be the owner of the site. We can’t implement this FOR them.”

“… We are talking to a couple platforms that are already working and have a user base. It will be pretty easy for them to implement Waves tokens so a user can register there, and issue an asset. So, it’s going to be nice.”

LOOTZ:  “We have a few people that are listening in right now. They’re yelling already ’…10 days! Full nodes are coming out in 10 days!’”

SASHA: “(Laughs) Yea. It is like, an estimate, but they should be (coming out). We won’t implement any new features. We probably have to fix a couple of bugs, but that’s all so… We have it all more or less ready.”

LOOTZ: “You get them all excited, man. You want to get people excited just tell them about full nodes.”

SASHA: “Yea, but I can see that the price is growing. On Bittrex, the price is rising. So, people are excited… So, it’s nice. The volume on Bittrex is nice; I just checked it out. It’s like, 500 Bitcoins.”

LOOTZ: “Oh yea the volume has been crazy every day. It’s very exciting. It’s all for one reason; no one is selling. If you’re smart, you’re not going to sell; there’s no reason to sell. It’s the dumbest thing if you do. Unless you really need it for whatever reason then you do what you have to do. But, in trading, in crypto, if you’ve been around as long as I have… there’s no day trading in crypto. You’re an idiot if you’re day trading. You’re going to lose your pants. What you do is, you gather as much as you can at a low price. When it skyrockets to like, $20.00 a coin, you know, you buy yourself a Ferrari… that’s the way smart people invest.”

SASHA: “It’s not like trading stocks because you can’t day trade crypto. That’s absolutely right because it’s totally unpredictable within just one day or even a week. You can predict a month or two, but not a shorter time period.”

LOOTZ: “Yea totally. Me personally, if I see it go low, I go ‘oh, that’s an opportunity.’ Like when it was in the 26k and 27k (Satoshi range) – that was opportunity right there. You’ve got to recognize opportunity when you see it. Right now I believe the price is still low. It (the price) is only 5,000 (Satoshi) above what the ICO price was. So, the opportunity is still here!”

SASHA: “Yes, just the beginning. Humble beginnings guys.”

LOOTZ: “Once fiat is implemented… Do you know of any other coins that have done something like that?”

SASHA: “I don’t think so, no. Ethereum, probably, they are going to have fiat soon because there are a couple of startups working on that. I know some people, but besides Ethereum no. And nothing is working as of now.”

LOOTZ: “Ethereum is a dead horse. It’s been out how long? It’s done what? What’s it done in the 3 years we’ve been hearing about it? It hasn’t done anything. Let me tell you, there marketing is probably what makes them so big.  If you go on Amazon, there are books about Ethereum. That’s how they’re getting to mainstream. There are audiobooks about Ethereum. When I listen to the audiobooks, and trust me, I’ve done my research on everything mainstream regarding crypto. Mostly Bitcoin is the big daddy of all of them. You hear Ethereum when they mention Bitcoin. They say, ‘oh, there’re alt-coins like Ethereum…’ inside these books. Then you get normal people investing in Ethereum because they don’t know about anything else other than what they read. So, that’s another way for people out there to get involved. It’s really easy to make an audiobooks and sell it on Audible for $6.00, $3.00. Even $1.00; you get a million people; you’ve made a million dollars. Make a book if you’re talented at writing make a book about Waves. It doesn’t have to be big. It can be 20 pages, and you sell the book. But, the point is, you get it mainstream. On Amazon, you call it the next Bitcoin and get people looking at it. I see these things. I listen to audiobooks on the way to work.  It takes one hour to get to work so I have nothing to do but listen to books. I educate myself back and forth from work.“

SASHA: “Ok, but well, Ethereum won’t die, I think. They just chose a very complicated path for development…”

LOOTZ: “Yea I heard there were another two forks this weekend.”

SASHA: “Yea they’re going to have many forks. They’re probably going to have a fork every week at some stage. But they chose this path, and they’re going to have to walk this way. They probably will succeed in the end. We just chose a different direction.”

LOOTZ: “Yea man you’re already ahead of the game. If you come out with… you said 10 days for nodes?”

SASHA: “Yes, it’s about 10 days if no dreadful bugs come up again. So, we’re going to have the full nodes in like, 10 days. Because, as I told you, we won’t implement any new features until we have the full nodes. We have the assets, and we have implemented the fee adjustment. So, we are quite ready to start the network where people can issue the custom tokens and transfer them. And after that, we will be working on the exchange. So, it’s going to be this thing with centralized matching… I think I’ve spoken about it many-many times and I think people may be tired of hearing about it.”

LOOTZ: “What kind of fiat will be implemented first when it first comes out?”

SASHA: “Probably Euro I think. Euro will be there, and later, Dollar. Yuan will then come next. Euro is the easiest thing here. We are working with a couple companies with licenses, payment transfer licenses, which can do this legally. They will be selling Euro and Dollar tokens for like, bank transfers. So, we will have gateways as soon as we have assets actually on our main net.  It’s all organized. We’ve talked to everybody and everybody is ready to do it. All we need is technical functionality. As soon as it’s there, we’re starting the whole thing.”

LOOTZ: “So what other surprised do you have for us when the main net comes out in 10 days?”

SASHA: “Yea, more or less. It’s my projection, and I think that it’s pretty possible. If nothing bad happens we will have it in about 10 days, so, the week after the next one. After that, we’re working on gateways and the decentralized exchange. Then, we’ll see what we can do. Probably we will work on some multi-sig approach, also some kind of gateway like, you have NXT with multi-gateway thing, and so you can deposit Bitcoin. Then you could have a Bitcoin asset on the Waves blockchain. After that, we will have to implement those scalability adjustments with authenticated data structures that we have done research on recently. So, because no one has this, and it’s pretty ground breaking research for crypto currencies because you can now see that there is a path that can lead you to scalable blockchains. We have to follow this way because otherwise, crypto will never become mainstream. If we don’t have high throughput, and if we don’t have scalability, we will never be able to conquer the world. It will (in such a case) always be some pretty marginal thing. We have to work on some business aspects. So, you can have thousands of transactions per second and the blockchain is small, scalable and you don’t have to download the whole blockchain to use the system. We have to work on all that. Otherwise, it’s going to be like science fiction, always, like what Ethereum is now. Like, you have some fancy terms with DAO, and whatever. The DAO hack; it sounds very cool, but it’s so far from business reality. You can write an audiobook about Ethereum, but you can’t really use it. You can use it as some prototype, but you really can’t use it for a business situation. You have to use blockchains for business, for real world use cases. Ethereum is very, very far from that. So, we want to focus on that, and we want to make cryptocurrencies mainstream. And, there have to be open blockchains because I can see very high activity in closed blockchains and permissioned ledgers. Every bank has some program, and consortiums like R3. If we don’t make an open platform, they’re going to have a permissioned platform, and blockchain will be very different from what we expect it to be. It won’t be like the open blockchain that Bitcoin offered. It will be a closed platform where you can’t enter the system. You will have to ask for permission. It’s not a proper blockchain. We have to have an open platform that can be used by real world businesses; not only Internet businesses, but also brick and mortar businesses. I think it’s very important. Otherwise, crypto will never become mainstream and banks, and payment institutions, will privatize cryptocurrency technology and the blockchains. Open blockchains will just die off otherwise… This is our goal to have open blockchain and make an open platform.”

LOOTZ: “…So in 10 days we’re going to have tokens, LPOS, right? And assets?”

SASHA: “LPOS won’t be there. We’ll have POS similar to what we have in NXT. We’ll work on LPOS later. It’ll come with scalability, not in 10 days. The main net will have what we have on the test net now. So, proof of stake, like more or less normal proof of stake, assets, and a kind of new fee schedule. What we have on the test-net is what we will have on the main net as soon as all bugs are eliminated and we are sure nothing bad happens. Also, we’re going to have some checkpoints just in case the blockchain has some issues so we’ll feel safe. So, for some time, we will have some centralized checkpointing. Maybe for a month or two we will have these things that will help us to secure the network. Otherwise, we are quite ready to release the full nodes and to let people install their full nodes and start forging. It won’t happen in a month or two, it will happen within like 10 days or maybe two weeks. We are almost there guys.”

LOOTZ: “How about Chinese gateways? Chinese fiat gateways. Any ideas on those? Any plans for that?”

SASHA: “We can have them, but we are focused on the Euro and the Dollar for now. I don’t think it’s complicated. It can be done, but they will come later. They will come after the Euro and the dollar. But, we will have them. We have many Chinese people we are talking to actually. It’s not so easy because crypto… it’s not banned of course in China, but you can’t work, as an institution in China, with Bitcoin. You can work with it only as a private person. It makes things a bit more complicated in China. But, we can probably do offshore Yuan. So we can work with Hong Kong; so it’s possible.”

LOOTZ: “We just have to wait for them to open their minds a bit more is all. They’re probably the biggest in Bitcoin. Most transactions, from what I’ve heard, 80% of them come from China.”

SASHA: “Yes actually Bitcoin now belongs to China more or less. It is a Chinese thing. I don’t know if it’s bad or good, but this is the reality. So, the government Is quite flexible about this. They don’t ban it. They don’t allow banks to work with Bitcoin, but they allow private persons to work with Bitcoin. So, it’s good in China, but it’s not so easy to implement, for example, a gateway for cryptocurrencies. So, probably it will take us some time. By the way, I’ve started learning Chinese. I think it’s useful. I can’t learn it for a lot of time (sic) but I go to some places. So, I hope that I will be able to speak Chinese in a year and to go to China, talk to some people, and make Waves one of the most popular currencies in China. China is very important.”

LOOTZ: “You’re going to be like Nicola Tesla. He was able to speak 9 different languages.”

SASHA: “Ah, I’m not so good with languages but I am doing my best.”

LOOTZ: “… There was a comparison out there. They were saying you look like Nicola Tesla, like a direct descendent…”

SASHA: “Oh come on guys. I am not a researcher. I am just, you know, a humble businessman. So, but I’m trying to get things done, and I’m going to do my best to get things done. I do everything necessary to get things done. So, this is my plan. This is my goal; to get things done and get things working. I can see that the world needs an open, widespread blockchain platform so I’m working on it. I hope that it’s going to work out just the way I’m planning this.”

“… (about full nodes). I don’t feel the pressure because you can see how we update the test-net releases. You can see what bugs we are fixing. You can see our progress. I think you can estimate on your own; everybody who follows our test-net release and everyone who is in the slack channel, ‘maintainers’, can evaluate our progress. They can make some reasonable estimate when we’re going to launch full nodes. 10 days to me seems very reasonable.”

LOOTZ: “… There was a major bug that was found; Hawky found it actually, right? So, big props to Hawky out there in the ‘test-net maintainers’ channel. Thank you for that.”

SASHA: “Yea yea. There was a pretty stupid bug. We tested it of course on our own, but somehow, we just didn’t see (it). We tried to do some kind of ICO, to distribute assets to holders, and this bug was obvious immediately. Some basic math didn’t work out properly. There was a bug in the code and it was fixed. Then some other bugs came up but we fixed them too, with the database and everything. It’s a pretty complicated system and we are doing our best to do it from scratch more or less. Probably, it was done in some systems before. Also, we used the Scorex library. On the other hand, you encounter so many issues when you are doing it, more or less, completely from scratch. So, it’s quite complicated guys. This network level… because, when people think about cryptocurrencies they think about mining and about transactions… A very important thing on a peer-to-peer level is the way that nodes connect to each other, and the way they distribute information to the network. The way they just accept new blocks; they send them into the network. This level is quite complicated, and no one really thinks about it. You know, in Ethereum there are very many problems with it. If you look closer into the Ethereum code, you can see that the focus is on smart contracts and everything. The peer-to-peer level is not so good, only in Bitcoin is it pretty good. Bitcoin is a great system. Very brilliant minds have been working on Bitcoin. Bitcoin is the only production ready system for now, because of this thing, the peer-to-peer level. You have to work really diligently on this to get it done properly. So, that’s what we are doing. It took us longer than expected but we are almost there. So within 10 days, or two weeks, we are going to have full nodes. Our main network will start working properly. You will be able to issue assets, do some crowdfunding, and transfer fiat money and everything. So, all that we promised will come to fruition. So it’s about several days; 10 to 14 days if nothing bad comes up. So guys, stay tuned.”

LOOTZ: “We have some questions here. When will full marketing begin? Will the full nodes release in 10 days? … Just in case they didn’t hear it a few thousand times …”

SASHA: “Yea guys as soon as our network is stable and we are completely confident that nothing bad can happen, we will start marketing the network as heavily as possible. It could be really bad if we start advertising and something bad happens. So, we might run into big troubles like this. We have to make absolutely sure our network is completely stable and that we don’t have any issues. Then we can calmly and confidently proceed to marketing. So, I think if we release the nodes in a couple weeks, we will wait for a couple weeks more, and then we will start proper marketing. All of our marketers are waiting for this. They have nothing to do now, so they are waiting for the full nodes. They really want to start tweeting, reposting, and everything. So, there’s like some cool off period of two weeks or a month after the full nodes release. Of course, there will be marketing right after we release the nodes but proper marketing will start later, about a month I think, after we release the full nodes.”

LOOTZ: “What’s the difference between the latest test-net update I saw? What’s the difference between 1.2 and 1.3?”

SASHA: “Some bug fixes, actually. We fixed this bug with this state, with the balance calculations of the assets, and we fixed some bug with the database. So, it’s like, minor fixes and we added the new fee schedule. But, it (the fee schedule) has to be tested yet. So, we will probably have another test-net release or maybe two before we launch the full nodes. So, stay tuned because the next week is going to be cool. Also, if you are helping us with testing, stay tuned because you will probably have to update your node again, or maybe even a couple times.”

LOOTZ: “How’s your team doing?”

SASHA: “It’s fine actually. We are hiring some new coders. Some very bright guys came to us. It’s pretty cool I think. We are moving into a new, bigger office in Central Moscow. It’s a pretty cool place. We’ll be able to have meetups there because there is a huge conference room there. It’s probably more famous here in Moscow. We will be able to use it for free and have conferences there. It will be really good for public relations and for marketing. I’ll probably be going to one meet-up or one conference a week. Maybe, even more. I’ll be traveling to Europe and other countries to promote. I was in Holland last week. I talked to some Dutch guys there. So, I talked to some Venture Capital people in Holland. It was good. It was my first trip, I didn’t really (have time to) prepare. I was there for one day. It was ok; I talked to some important and interesting people. I will be doing this more often. I will be going to, probably, Germany soon and to other countries.“

LOOTZ: “…By going to all these different countries, you’ll be educating others about Waves?”

SASHA: “Yea absolutely. I just went to Holland to talk to some VC people. I had said that ‘if someone was in Holland, or Amsterdam, let’s meet up’. Several people came, you know, without preparation. Basically like, I will go to many countries and I can meet people who know what Waves is and probably some investors – some people who are interested. I think it’s great and very useful for Waves as a platform. I’ll be going, not for long maybe, but a couple of days to Germany, to the U.K. and to major countries to promote.”

LOOTZ:  “How about Bioviva; have we heard anything new about that?”

SASHA: “I don’t know actually. I’m not talking to them now, but I think that we can return to discussions with them as soon as we have tokens. I’m not really 100% sure that they can reach their goals because it’s so… you know I don’t want to have some like, impact from their failure. If they fail, it can somehow effect Waves. I’m not sure that they’re going to succeed with their efforts so I’m going to be talking to them as soon as we have the tokens. But, everybody can come to the platform and issue the tokens. We don’t have to, you know, promote. Everyone can come and start their campaign, issue tokens, and start trading or start some kind of ICO. So, we need to be somehow kind of detached from this. We can’t endorse any projects. We can cooperate somehow, but we cannot endorse. Otherwise, we have this DAO situation. The DAO was kind of endorsed by the Ethereum Foundation guys, and everyone knows what happened next. So, we need to be somewhat separated from this. We can’t endorse anybody. We can cooperate and say, ‘ok, it’s an interesting project’ but we can’t really be working with them on you know some kind of monetary basis. We have to be detached from all of this.”

LOOTZ: “So we heard a while ago that you were looking for a Scorex Guru. Have you found your master Scorex guru?”

SASHA: “Scorex… we’re going to, actually, we have almost recoded the whole of Scorex. Alexander Chepurnoy is ‘doing the new Scorex from zero (sic)’, and some kind of different system that can be directly used in production. So we have decided to recode all of the previous Scorex code. There won’t be any trace of Scorex soon in our code base. So, we don’t need to stick to this old Scorex code base. So there will be Scorex 2.0. It’s a very nice thing from a theoretical, research point of view to use some of their ideas, but we won’t be using the code directly. We will be coding our own code so we will be totally independent from other teams. It is all going to be in-house.”

LOOTZ: “… The earlier you believe in a project; it’s up to you. There were a lot of people in Ethereum. Look at Ethereum now. It’s kind of sad, but you have to believe in the projects early. You have to do your homework too. I personally believe in Sasha. You’ve done Coinomat already. You’ve done a lot of projects in the past that were successful that I know about, off of the NXT network. You just have to believe in it. If you’re a day trader, you’re not really going to do very well…”

“… Did you want to add anything more to the show Sasha? Anything surprises?”

SASHA: “I think that I have talked about everything…Well, we’re going to have this new (updated) show, with the new girl (reporter). I don’t know if it’s already on YouTube, but check it out once it’s there. Check it out and tell us know how you like her (the new reporter). Stay tuned for the full nodes, and I can repeat this, the estimated time of arrival is 10 days. You can follow the progress in our slack. You can estimate by test-net releases how fast we are proceeding. You can probably agree that 10 days is a reasonable estimate. So, have a little patience. We are testing the network and it’s all going to be fine. Everyone’s going to make money. The most important thing is that we will be able to create the system that we want to create. It’s going to be much more important than making some money by trading guys. If we do it (create the system), it can be huge, really huge. Many people who are involved can probably get pretty rich and stuff like that, but it’s going to be a big system that can be used by real world businesses. That is the most important thing here. So, let’s focus on like, real world here. Not on trading and not on making some, small money. If we can make it work, we can make some bigger money, yea? If you think in these terms… If you’re thinking about usability of this thing (the system), it can be very usable, very good for business, and for the world in general. So stay tuned, help us create the thing, and I’m happy to work without community. Guys, you are just great people, and I’m really happy that you are helping us.”

LOOTZ: “If centralized exchanges use Waves Platform to secure their users’ funds, do they need to run their exchange through the Waves app, or can it be done through their own website?”

SASHA: “No, they can just connect through the API. So they’ll probably have to install the full nodes and they can connect to the API, or use a module in the full node, a trading module. So either the API or they install the full node and use the module for the exchange. It can be done in two ways.”

LOOTZ: “Is Incent going to be implemented as soon as the full nodes come out?”

SASHA: “Yea we will be working with them. I’m going to be talking to Rob (CEO of Incent). We wanted to talk today, but I just got mixed up about the time because he’s in Australia. It can get complicated (laughs). So, we’ll be talking tomorrow probably. Incent is great, and I think it is a very sound project. It’s pretty straight-forward and not so sophisticated. It’s a simple loyalty rewards token. It’s definitely doable. We’ll be helping Incent in any way we can.”

LOOTZ: “Alright. Thank you Sasha for coming on.”

SASHA: “Thank you for having me… See you later. See you guys.”